@areon

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

@Zypheran Yes please

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

@anthropy

I think these situations aren't exactly comparable because the focus of the furry fandom lies somewhere else: in the appreciation of animal characters. A lot of therians etc may be furries, but there are also a lot of furries to whom being a furry is simply about art, designing characters, roleplay and having fun without a deeper connection to animals. It's hard to talk about shifts and animal spirits and all such topics with the latter because they simply don't share this part of you at all. And if these topics aren't relevant, it's unlikely for different views on them to be caught up in the same dynamics as in the alterhuman community. But this also means the furry fandom isn't a "replacement" for the alterhuman community because the interactions they desire aren't in the foreground.

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

I suspect this monolithization of communities may also be one of the factors behind the therian/otherkin communities turning more and more indistinguishable from one another and the emergence of the alterhuman community which understands itself as an umbrella for all these identities. Many consider it a positive development, and I will concede that it is the logical conclusion to reach since all of this is based on subjective experiences without an objective truth behind it. However, I see it more critically for one big reason: these communities actually only cater to one specific mindset.

I talked about it many times before. I'm a very analytical person and above all else, I strive to understand our world the way it is, not the way I wish it was. Beliefs have limits, and it's important to recognize what their limits are. Holding beliefs is perfectly fine as long as they don't get in the way of rational thought.

And yet, this is exactly what these communities encourage. Members will commonly talk about their beliefs as if they were objective facts; that they have science on their side by making statements such as "I am psychologically a wolf" as if that by itself needs no further explanation or proof. Word games such as "I am a wolf, therefore my body is a wolf's body" serve no other purpose than allowing someone to say "I'm a wolf" with the conviction that they're more legitimate than others.

People like me can't properly talk about our views because they will often be perceived as disruptive by the majority. You will be criticized, you will be called an elitist, and any negative feelings stemming from having your needs constantly disregarded are entirely your own fault.

The reason why I'm only talking about topics related to therianthropy in my little corner here is that these communities aren't such open-minded spaces after all. People underestimate just how gigantic the effort would have to be to bring a huge crowd with vastly different views together, and to maintain an environment where everyone talks about them on equal terms. If you can't do that, cramming everything under one umbrella does more harm than good because ultimately, the majority erases everyone else.

#volpeonWrites

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

@digitalfox

Yeah, it's pretty close, but with the caveat that they live alongside the global space so I have doubts about their effectiveness. It does make sense from their standpoint: my proposal would result in a fundamentally different experience, whereas Mastodon's group feature is an extension.

You can actually see how this works out by looking at Tumblr. From what I know about it, Tumblr is pretty similar to microblogging in that everything takes place in a global space and so all of the same dynamics are true for it as well.
It got communities as a first-class feature a while ago, and just like Mastodon's feature they exist alongside the existing system. And to me, it looks like most activity still takes place in the latter. Probably because that's what people are used to, maybe because communities raise the barrier ever so slightly so they feel annoying or pointless to use. Those are my guesses at least.

@Elrick_Winter @caohuak

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

@caohuak

I don't think it wouldn't work from a technical standpoint, but from a social one. The simple fact of the matter is that people overall are lazy fucks. This includes me. If circles were to be introduced, I would expect people to use the public one most of the time because most posts on here are short and have very little to say. It would take more time to organize your circles and setting the right ones than the post itself.
Hell, we did have groups on fedi via Guppe and I can count the number of times I've seen someone use them on one hand. I could also theoretically handle groups via my NodeBB instance. It wouldn't even be difficult, but it's still too much effort.

What we'd need to do instead is moving the focus to communities so that you essentially post into them instead of into your profile (i.e. the global space). It would be like mandatory circles, but it wouldn't feel like an annoying forced choice because the application would make them a more natural part of the workflow.

@digitalfox @Elrick_Winter

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

@Elrick_Winter @digitalfox Yep, circles were basically lists of people and when posting you could define which circles it was going to shared with. Made a lot of sense for the slower and longer format of Google+, but I'm sure this wouldn't work here at all

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

@SteffoSpieler I think it's fine with a blog because the volume is lower and the format incentivizes a more balanced way to express yourself. I also often find that blogs do have per-category feeds (mine included) which helps with letting people choose what they're interested in.

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

The fediverse is actually better in this regard because ActivityPub and its lack of a global view acts as an additional isolating force. Don't take this as endorsement of instances as communities, though, because they're still lacking in all the ways I described and the solution would be applicable on any kind of technology.

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

On microblogging and how it normalizes fascist methods of control.

This is a post I made somewhere else and mostly just pasted below. It therefore repeats some of the points I keep making on this account.

--

If we look at our lives outside of social media, we see that we interact with different people in different settings all the time. We chat with coworkers at the office about annoying customers, or talk about personal topics with family members. With very close friends we're willing to talk about personal topics, but only if we're in a more private space rather than, say, a cafe. The standards dictating our behavior change depending on the context: the people involved, our relationship with them, the setting and possibly other factors.

Microblogging is often portrayed as a mirror of society, a global space in which participants organize themselves organically and interact with each other as usual. Want to be part of the furry community? Just follow a bunch of furries. Sounds easy enough, and indeed that's how people use these platforms. And that's a problem because it's all a lie. You follow people as one whole package, but people are rarely all about one topic. You will see anything they post, repost and quote, regardless of whether it's the art they create or a statement about the current political climate. You will see it all in your timeline, and conversely this means that you can never be certain of who is going to see your posts. A post intended for fellow insect enthusiasts may end up in someone's timeline with a phobia of insects, who demands such posts be hidden behind a content warning. The "global town square" is a paradigm of chaos with endlessly clashing standards because it doesn't work at all the way we expect.

And now I can finally get to the crux of this post: I can see how social media normalizes certain aspects of fascism to its users, or at least I can see it very clearly with microblogging.

Communities on these platforms are loosely established by proximity with (i.e. following) other members, which leads to them only being able to exist as monoliths on the network. People use phrases such as "the _ community on Bluesky" or "furry twitter", so they understand that this is the case, but I don't think I've ever seen anyone question the implications: On other platforms or in the outside world, there can be multiple communities for the same subject with varying standards and values. You may withdraw temporarily or join a different community if you don't feel comfortable somewhere. On Bluesky, Twitter et al, this is impossible.

On the one hand, the situation you're placed in as a user feels reminiscent of being the target of surveillance. No matter who my posts are intended for, they're going to be broadcast to anyone, even people I would choose to exclude to avoid unnecessary conflict. If I write about my views on identity which some therians will appreciate and many won't, then the latter will see my posts nonetheless and feel compelled to react. They will voice their displeasure, come up with unfavorable interpretations behind my back, and maybe even show up to tell me how wrong I am. You automatically start to think about how your words might be received by this huge mass of people and maybe choose to remain silent after all.

On the other hand, the reverse is true as well: You get used to the idea that anyone's activity can be seen by you, that you're entitled to have a full view of "your" community, and that opposing undesired views is an act of preserving community values. It's easy to forget that in doing so, you may be part of a repressive majority because you leave the minority no place on the network to just be. And others will consciously take advantage of this dynamic and wield their popularity as a weapon.

#volpeonWrites

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

@ada

Absolutely true! Communities on Twitter et al are an emergent phenomenon resulting from placing us in a unique social situation we simply never encounter in real life.
Microblogging positions itself as a huge global space where everyone can just be themselves and interact with each other naturally as it happens. Communities form on their own by proximity (i.e. following) with other people. I assume this simply has to happen because our lives always take place in varying limited contexts and we subconsciously try to replicate them so our minds understand how to handle this situation. That's probably why so many people seemingly forget that they never left the global context to begin with. It's the cause of many problems we're seeing here, and in fact I realized it's actually even worse. I plan to talk about it in a dedicated post.

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

I've grown so tired of microblogging that I find myself starting to think that even Discord is better. Do you know what Discord gives you that microblogging doesn't? Clearly separated communities. Multiple communities per subject. Hell, everything gives you that except for certain platforms.

If everything takes place in a global context like I explained many times before, then communities can only exist as monoliths on the platform. People like to say "the _ community on Bluesky" or "furry twitter" without ever questioning the implications.

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

@gwenthefops @volpeon I see what you did

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

@kura @cato

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

@volpeon Well, it's ok as long as I don't create a separate @corveon account as well.

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

@cato Shit, do I have to come up with a carpetsona now?

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

@volpeon Hell, I'm confused myself. The account name is Areon, the avatar is Corveon, the display name is Volpeon. Good job, me.

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

@volpeon Birb is now over here, but I also decided to not use the character names after all because it's bound to get confusing as heck.

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

@volpeon Part of it being that I really want to be a creature rather than a human. It's meh because it's not like I can do anything about that, obviously

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

7mo

Lately, I've been thinking about online communities again.

I've always been more of a lurker in communities. I am either not sure how to contribute, or I feel that my knowledge on a subjects is too inadequate to join the conversation.

There's this one forum I check out all the time. It's almost dead, but every once in a while there will be really interesting discussions among the members that always leave me with a feeling of having learned something new. This feeling has become rare in the modern social media landscape, which makes spaces like this one even more precious to me. I realized that if I don't want to lose it, I will have to get more involved. Because without making your presence known, nobody who remains will see that you're still there. They'll be left with the frustration of dwindling activity until they finally leave that place themselves. And then it'll be too late.

Honestly, I'm growing increasingly sick of social media. The current discussion on said forum has lead me to realize that when I wrote volpeon.ink/notebook/microblogging-misdesign/ , I had stopped short of bringing my analysis to its proper conclusion. Microblogging isn't the only type of platform following the "global town square" model, and there are in fact far worse implications stemming from its lack is context not just in the scope of the platform, but also outside of it. I will write a proper post about this at a later time.

Volpeon Extra @areon@icy.wyvern.rip

8mo

Actually, I do understand it. Therianthropy in its current form considers species to be something like gender, a social role that is detached from one's physical appearance. To them, "being an animal" doesn't refer to their body and mind being that of an animal, but rather it's an aesthetic. It's their presentation on the internet and their lifestyle IRL, possibly wearing a tail or ears, chatting with others in VR as animals, and so on. In that context, the message of these images makes sense.

I just wish people didn't forget about those like me who don't subscribe to this understanding. It's not like I'm doing this by choice, you know?

This post is relevant, in case you haven't read it yet: icy.wyvern.rip/notes/aalcft7a1f59jc4a